Denver Research
General Category => ezPower => Topic started by: Courtright on April 23, 2015, 11:27:42 AM
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Something I just realized that I think could be fixed and honestly should be fixed if possible. Any manager that has the ability to "Add New Product" (but not enough security for Product Control to actually edit current stock quantity) could get in a new shipment, in our case picture a $500 Ferrari Edition Sunglass. They create a "new product" for it and give it the right price and all the details. I have them start the STOCK quantity at ZERO so they can "adjust stock" afterwards and then I have a paper trail within the REPORTS that I can print out to compare it to the packing slip and my list of orders.
However, if a manager creates a new product and for stock uses -1 (negative one) they could still go and check in the inventory under "inventory adjust" and have a report showing they actually checked one in inventory. Then since that $500 pair has a stock now in the system of 0 after they scanned it in (up from -1), they could steal it and the inventory count would still be spot on and there would be a paper trail showing they scanned in the new order properly. It wouldn't be until someone started asking "hey, where's that new Ferrari frame at?" and then searching the reports to see if it was sold, etc. The whole time with the inventory count being spot on. And in our case with thousands upon thousands of sunglasses certain $300 pairs would go unnoticed as long as the inventory count is spot on and they were checked in.
My thoughts should be with "Add New Product" either the inability to go with negative numbers or simply no ability to change STOCK at all. Any owner would want the product trail of that being left zero and then scanning them in later during "inventory adjust".
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Hmm, I don't think so. There is no limit to what you can do if you are a manager that can create a product. That kind of scrutiny requires you to compare your purchase invoices with a stock count.
BTW - Inventory Adjust is for adding new stock. Stock Correction is for counting and adjusting the inventory. It will keep a record what was over/under.
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Is there a reason you can think of as to why it would be beneficial to allow negative numbers upon "Adding New Product" (green circle button with white plus sign)? I couldn't see how even allowing negative numbers would ever be beneficial since you cannot have negative product stock, only 0. By blocking the ability for anything negative that completely alleviates this possible flaw but I can't imagine a way in which it would ever be missed, except for by the people who are stealing. In most cases, comparing live stock quantity to invoices is nearly impossible. We can get shipments everyday from 30 pairs up to sometimes over 100 pairs in a store that has thousands upon thousands in stock, going up to $500. Retailers like myself use a POS system to reduce headache, which in this case would cause a ton of work everyday. Or if the system didn't allow the ability to use negative stock upon creation then it would fix it. This is the only way in which a manager could easily steal product since most basic managers wouldn't have security clearance for Product Edit and manually adjust stock. Their only chance is upon creating a new one.
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If you sell more than you have (ie backorder) the stock will be negative until you add new stock.
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I agree with the fact that new opening stock should be a positive number only, if you allow negative stock for a new product it would/could cause a problem with future stock takes. In reality you trust mangers to to enter product codes correctly. Putting negative stock as an opening stock balance is at best a mistake, but potentially it could be much more, best to always star a new product as zero then do an adjustment afterwards if you need to add or remove stock for what ever reason
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If you sell more than you have (ie backorder) the stock will be negative until you add new stock.
Yeah, I am completely aware of that which is fine but that was not what I was talking about. I am only talking about the ability to create brand new product for the first time. A product you've never had before so you hit the green circle with the white plus sign "Add Product". It's similar to Product Edit but with a lot less features. So upon creating a product for the first time, starting it with a negative number should never even be a possibility, as moresby agrees with in their reply.
I still completely understand that allowing the system to go negative so you could sell a product if you had it but the system said zero is completely fine. Because once a product is created a manager should never be allowed to manually adjust inventory levels without a trail in the report center. A product should always be created with a stock of zero and then "checked in" by using Inventory Adjust so there is a paper trail. Problems can only arise with allowing the ability to set a New Product to negative numbers upon its initial creation. I can't think of any case in which anyone would ever want it to be set at a negative number.
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Some businesses do special orders for items they don't normally carry.
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Right, we I actually do myself. Let's say a customer wants a pair of Ray Bans we don't normally stock. We tell them we will order them in for them. When they arrive, we can create a brand new product for the first time ever but we still would only set the beginning inventory level at zero, even if it is a special order item we normally don't carry there would never be a reason to start the stock of a new product at negative quantity, only ever zero. If a manager were to start a special order item at negative 1 stock, then when scanned in it would now be zero when in reality you have 1 on stock. There would never be a reason anyone would create a brand new product for the first and ever need to use a negative number for stock quantity. The ONLY reason would be if they are planning on stealing something.
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Also, I'm only trying my best to help find flaws so you guys can have the best POS system on the market. I truly love this system and have told about a dozen businesses about how much I recommend it, which I know 2 have bought. For some reason I feel invested in this software most likely because I use it every day and as a previous developer/coder love the functionality of it. I'm just trying to bring light to issues like this that to me don't make sense from a retailers point of view. A new Product should never be allowed negative stock numbers since there isn't a single situation in which it should be negative besides trying to steal. That button for "Add New Product" should have everything but a stock quantity option. You should be able to create the product and then after creating it add it to the POS system afterwards through "Inventory Adjust." Just my 2 cents and I think anyone that uses this software for retail would agree. To know that there is this flaw where a manager (I have 4) could steal merchandise is scary. I'm sitting on $400,000 worth of inventory that is a headache just to try and stay on top of without having to scrutinize if current stock quantity matches, product added to inventory and comparing it to purchase orders, etc. I just think it's something to REALLY consider. If you were to ask a dozen of your retailer accounts about this and inform them of this flaw I think all of them would agree that there isn't a need for ever having negative stock numbers upon a products INITIAL creation.
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How about if you pretty please consider altering this in some way I'll upgrade to version 14.
Pretty sure that's a bribe, lol. ;)
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What happens if a manager edits the inventory and changes the quantity from 3 to 2 and then steals that item?
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First, in v14 I can't find any "Add New Product" other than in Product Control. Or do you mean "Quick Add"? If that, I don't see any option to add a negative value.
I've insisted on adding any new Products at my business, but came to realize that I couldn't get by without giving someone else access to the quantities. And at that point, what's to keep someone (as Ronald stated) from simply changing quantities to steal something? Even if you have them use "Adjust Stock", I don't know of a way of tracking it if they don't choose to print a report.
I think there's an incredible degree of control over who has access to what. Hopefully you have someone you can trust to not be stealing from you!
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I think you guys are possibly not understanding then what I was describing.
I DO mean "Quick Add". If you want to create a product from scratch the best way for a manager to do it is Quick Add. Using "Quick Add" it lets you set a beginning stock. Which in reality upon creating a product for the very first time, beginning stock should always be zero because it can be adjusted a second later by going to inventory adjust. So, rjmeyer, I do mean "Quick Add" and by putting "-1" for the stock it is now starting with a -1 stock value. The manager now checks in a $500 item, prints out a report showing 1 items was checked in using "Adjust Stock" which I compare to the packing slip which shows 1 item was shipped.
1 item shipped and my manager checked in 1 item ... but stock quantity is now actually zero! So although it looks like everything was done right she can steal that pair and inventory count is always on because she created the product from scratch with -1 Stock. And to give you an idea, if I get 50 pairs of sunglasses in today some may be auto shipped new styles I didn't order but the manufacturer says I need, so they ship them to me without knowing. When she opens the box and the system says we never had them, she'll create them that second and then scan them into inventory adjust afterwards and put them out for sale.
(CONTINUED.......)
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(.....PART 2)
What happens if a manager edits the inventory and changes the quantity from 3 to 2 and then steals that item?
Ronald, due to Security Settings she has NO ability to ever adjust inventory levels once she creates a product. She does not have security clearance for "Product Edit" so she literally cannot edit ANY existing inventory and change the quantity from 3 to 2. Impossible. The only way she can remove inventory is via "Inventory Adjust" in which there is a trail and I print weekly reports for Inventory Adjust, Returns, etc.
The ONLY time my managers EVER have the ability to affect inventory without a paper trail via Inventory Adjust is upon initially creating the inventory for the first time using "Quick Add". Hopefully that clears it up a little bit. Upon using Quick Add, since it is so limited as is it should be limited to not having any input for STOCK at all, especially negative numbers. Being that it is a stripped down version to New Product > Product Edit it should remain stripped down with zero quantity adjustment. Then when a manager creates a product this way, if they need to add it to inventory afterwards they do so like they would all new incoming inventory ...scan it with inventory adjust and "Add to Stock"
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Did that above reply help in better understanding the situation? Let me know if you have any other questions. Like I stated, upon a products initial creation it's the only time my manager can control inventory levels. Access to anything like Product Edit is blocked through Security Settings. Just test it out, use "QUICK ADD", make a new product and set the stock to -1.
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So you can audit everything done in "Adjust Stock" even if no report is generated? How do you do that?
It took a minute to figure out your procedure. I would have never thought of stretching it into a two-step process. So you really don't add the quantity at the time the Quick Add is done? Are you not able to track what's been entered in Quick-Add? (I have no idea, since I don't use it)
Okay, let's say that's the only way you can audit the numbers - that you can audit what your person is doing - is if "Adjust Stock" is used (and I don't know that that's the case), and that you can NOT if the quantity is added during "Quick Add" If that's the case, wouldn't it be more straightforward to just see whether Quick-Add can be made to be audit-able in the same way it sounds like "Adjust Stock" is?
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So you can audit everything done in "Adjust Stock" even if no report is generated? How do you do that?
So, in my opinion "Adjust Stock" should be the only way in which inventory is added to or removed from your POS System, hence the name "Adjust Stock". So, once inventory is scanned you can either add it to stock with "Add to Stock" or remove it with "Send to Shortage". The great thing about having all inventory go through this channel is at any time you can run a report on both.
For inventory add it is: REPORTS > INVENTORY > ADJUST
For inventory removed it is: REPORTS > INVENTORY > SHORTAGE
So, once a week a manager will run a shortage report so I can verify if anything was removed without my doing.
Now, when new product arrives (and lets just say it is already been in the system so it's just more stock of that item) they just got to "Inventory Adjust", scan it and add it to stock. Now, once finished, they go to "REPORTS > INVENTORY > ADJUST (select Today's Date)" and print that report and staple it to the packing slip and file it away in a folder on my desk. So now I can compare the packing slip that says 14 items were shipped (and it shows all their info) and make sure 14 of the exact same items were scanned in. Also, I hold on to my original purchase orders to make sure everything actually makes it to the store and nothing is stolen before it gets scanned in. Once scanned in, I combine the original purchase order, the packing slip and "Adjust Stock Report" all together. This is the only instance in which inventory can ever be deducted or added to my POS System. All other functions are disabled for anyone but the Admin because of security settings.
(CONTINUED....)
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(Part 2)
Upon creating a product for the first time, my manager ONLY uses "QUICK ADD" because of how basic it is and allowing her any other access would then give her the ability to change inventory levels, which no owner would want their manager doing when they have $300,000 worth of products on hand. So she creates a new product this way, leaves the stock empty or at zero and then scan it in through inventory adjust so there is a paper trail. But as explained thoroughly before, if she sets it to -1 Stock upon its initial creation and then still adds it to inventory the report shows it was added to inventory but in reality the inventory now says zero
since it started at -1.
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(PART 3)
It took a minute to figure out your procedure. I would have never thought of stretching it into a two-step process. So you really don't add the quantity at the time the Quick Add is done? Are you not able to track what's been entered in Quick-Add? (I have no idea, since I don't use it)
We do not add the Quantity at the time "Quick Add" is done for the sole purpose that it cannot be tracked with a report. So again, if your manager gets in a $500 product that we have never had in the system before and creates it from scratch using Quick Add and sets the inventory to 0 and you don't add it in via "Adjust Stock" how do you know she even added it in? You might say, "well as an owner you should know if a $500 item is out for sale on your floor." But in reality, it's a spec of sand on a beach. We're a sunglass store with thousands of sunglasses ..... thousands upon thousands in stock and displayed. As long as inventory count is right, not realizing a style was never put out is almost impossible. Especially when we're open 7 days a week in the Summer from 9am until midnight. It's like a manager not putting out a set of stainless steel 1/4" x 3" bolts at Home Depot. How long would it take for the Owner of H.D. to not realize those bolts never made it to the floor? If there's not a series of check-in reports he would never know.
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(PART 4)
Okay, let's say that's the only way you can audit the numbers - that you can audit what your person is doing - is if "Adjust Stock" is used (and I don't know that that's the case), and that you can NOT if the quantity is added during "Quick Add" If that's the case, wouldn't it be more straightforward to just see whether Quick-Add can be made to be audit-able in the same way it sounds like "Adjust Stock" is?
Possibly, but that honestly seems more work then simply deleting the beginning Stock allowment through "Quick Add" or not allowing negative numbers using "Quick Add".
You see, if a business owner is not checking to make sure reports are being run on items checked into inventory then their manager in charge might as well have access to creating new Products through Product Control or Product Edit. Quick Add, which is a very basic way to add inventory, shouldn't then also allow anyone to mess with inventory levels at all. The most important thing I can say to that is "Quick Add" doesn't allow for all the custom ways of setting up a Product like Product Edit does. It's a stripped down version of it with just the basics. If that is so why even give someone the opportunity to steal when inventory can just be checked in afterwards using the correct way of Inventory Adjust? and therefore tracked with Reports. Allowing someone else besides the owner to create a product with "Quick Add" but also let them set beginning inventory isn't a safe procedure. The perfect example is the one I keep saying over and over..... (continued)
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(PART 5 )
1. Manager gets in a new $500 Product
2. Adds it using "Quick Add"
3. Sets stock to -1
4. Checks it in using "Adjust Stock" (so they can prove it was checked in via Reports)
5. Selects "Add to Stock"
6. Product is now at a stock of zero after 1 was checked in
7. Manager steals it
8. Inventory count is still dead on because product (although checked in) is at a stock of zero, up from its initial creation of -1 Stock.
This is something I really really think should be addressed, either removing the ability to set Stock altogether and checking it in via "Inventory Adjust" or simply adjusting the code to not allow negative numbers, you can use zero or anything higher. But there should NEVER be a reason to start a new product with negative stock. If you put in -1 and try to submit it a pop-up box would appear saying [Negative values are not allowed for "Stock" field], forcing the person to leave it at least at zero or setting it to whichever value they want if they choose to not add inventory to their system via "Inventory Adjust"
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First, with all your examples, it seems that allowing ANY quantity to be entered in Quick-Add is not a good idea. If what you say is true and there's no way to audit it, why would you want to allow ANY manipulation of quantity in there?
Besides that, though - and to wander from the software itself for a moment - I think it's easy to go too far down that path of agonizing over employee dishonesty. I really don't think any business is ever going to be able to plug up every possible form of employee theft, and I don't think any piece of software is going to prevent it if a person is determined and has any sort of computer skills. I've worked with inventory-related software with perpetual inventories for 20-25 years now, and have yet to see one where inventory does not have to be corrected from time to time for reasons not related to pilferage.
I had my business going for 2-3 years before I brought in employees, and I had one hell of a time adjusting to having to trust someone else. I eventually decided that I either had to trust them implicitly or get rid of them. And I continue to watch for signs of anything under-handed going on, but I'd have been forced by ulcers or something years ago if I focused on every last bit of minutiae.
I try to reward my employees generously - partially to enhance their "buy-in" to want the business to so well, but also to keep them from feeling the urge to "even up" by resorting to something like theft. I feel that this approach has done well for me, as I'm celebrating my 10th year in business this year with both sales and profits continuing to improve substantially.
But yeah, maybe "quantity" should not be allowed to be entered in Quick-Add.
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Thank you for understanding the flaw I found. I try to find these flaws before my employees do and this is pretty much the only one I can see left where it's impossible to allow a manager to add new product but also stop theft. If this issue was resolved, then using my kind of security settings and having inventory only checked-in/shortaged through "Inventory Adjust" then I don't see any possible way an employee could ever manipulate inventory levels. I've tried it.
I agree with you on how to treat employees so they're vested in your business and care about it. I started this store 14 years ago and actually have not had a single "brand name" sunglass stolen by an employee luckily. Even if I have the most honest people working for me, trust is always still a huge issue with me since I have been burned so many times in the past on a personal trust level with half a dozen people, even my brother stealing thousands from me. So, I cover myself so I don't have to worry so much.
Ronald, did my thorough explanation in the previous replies better help you understand the flaw and how it's the only situation in which inventory levels are not reported? Would you guys consider not allowing negative numbers in Quick Add?
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Ronald, I was hoping the better explanation in my 5 part reply would help you understand the situation and flaw in the "Quick Add" System.
I am pretty sure that anyone using your software adding inventory the correct way (with checks and balances) would definitely like a resolve. Just by not allowing negative numbers in Quick Add would fix this issue. It's the only flaw in my system where a manager can steal merchandise and there is no way to track it. I know you believe shrinkage should be considered "part of retail" but for 14 years of business I have never had a single brand name pair come up missing or stolen by an employee because of our strict inventory checking, twice a day. However, if one was taken out upon creation via "Quick Add" I would never have known.
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We get a 1000 request every year for that one super import, I have to have it feature. Everyone runs their business a different way. I seem to remember we've addressed several of your request. Just hold your hat on.
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Yeah, I completely understand. You've addressed numerous things I've brought up but I hope you understand I can make due with the initial program the way I purchased it, being someone who used to code for 8 years I guess I'm more interested in "helping out." I simply am trying to offer my assistance to help you have the best software on the market without loop-holes like these. I always figure things can't progress for the better if others didn't make us aware of things that could possibly be improved upon. In the end, I'm simply trying to help. ;)
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YOU ARE THE BEST!!!!! ;D
I'll be buying Version 14, does that include this stock issue update?
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Yes, if it works out.